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 On Duty use of the Commissary
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FD73
Rookie

USA
26 Posts

Posted - Jul 28 2011 :  21:06:34  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I was wondering if any installations allow use of the Commissary for DoD Civilians while on Duty at the FD. If so, are there any regulations that you can refer me to on this topic. I want to try and get approval for our firefighters to use the Commissary but doing my homework first. I am hoping if there is not any specific guidance on this i can get an agreement between the FD / Commissary and signed by the Commander. Any information would be appreciated.

Hog Chief
Lt

Afghanistan
117 Posts

Posted - Jul 29 2011 :  12:08:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Normally the use is for Active, Retired, Guard or Reserve ID card holders. I have been at a base where they let us use the commisary but always had to have an id card holder with them and he had to make the purchase.. All you can do is ask the management of your store, its either yea, maybe or nah.

Proud Veteran, "Support your Deployed Firefighters"
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gochargers
Lt

235 Posts

Posted - Jul 29 2011 :  12:46:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
We have an agreement with the commissary that on-duty firefighters in uniform are allowed to shop there, and we even have the same privileges as on-duty SFS and other military members in uniform duty peak hours. As Hog Chief said, it's an agreement between your dept and the commissary management. Don't forget to work out the GOV use at eating facilities if you guys haven't already done so.
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oldtimer78
Lt

USA
102 Posts

Posted - Jul 30 2011 :  06:42:40  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So I guess I'll ask the obvious question....why should civilians be allowed to use a military benefit? I can't think of a good reason to extend military benefits to folks that aren't authorized their use. If the use of the commissary is OK, why not the BX? How about the class 6 store for civilians that just got off duty? Can a civilian fire fighter in the community shop at COSTCO when they are on duty? Even if they could, are they sending the right message?? Why should fire fighters receive preferential treatment anywhere? Because of what we do for the community? C'mon, let's think this through. Can you accept a free cup of coffee because you are in uniform? How about a free meal at Denny's? A round of golf? Why not a free suit at the Mens Wearhouse? My point is, we have great jobs with superb benefits, MUCH BETTER than our military counterparts in the fire station. I personally have not earned the right to shop at the commissary, but I am able to do so because my wife gave 20 years to the Air Force...I don't understand this discussion, and I have been hearing the debate for more than 30 years.....

quote:
Originally posted by FD73

I was wondering if any installations allow use of the Commissary for DoD Civilians while on Duty at the FD. If so, are there any regulations that you can refer me to on this topic. I want to try and get approval for our firefighters to use the Commissary but doing my homework first. I am hoping if there is not any specific guidance on this i can get an agreement between the FD / Commissary and signed by the Commander. Any information would be appreciated.

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FD73
Rookie

USA
26 Posts

Posted - Jul 30 2011 :  07:00:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Oldtimer, not to get into a debate on who and who should not receive commissary privileges. It seems as a convenient place to grab a thing or two for dinner for the firefighters. If you want to look at who should and should not receive commissary privilieges you should look at the folks who served one year and got medically discharged because of horseplay, however they can use the commissary forever, on the other hand you have folks who served 4, 6, 8 years active duty and do not get the benefit. So firefighters on duty in uniform shouldnt get the same benefit? hmmm

In closing their are far bigger fish to fry in the GOV...
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FD73
Rookie

USA
26 Posts

Posted - Jul 30 2011 :  07:03:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
One more point to look at, if you look in the DODI that covers DOD Commissaries you will find that individuals who work for the Commissary are authorized to use the Commissary while on duty, and on duty firefighters who work 24 hours per day shouldnt get the same courtesy?
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fyremt
New

1 Posts

Posted - Jul 30 2011 :  10:54:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Is the consensus that civ firefighters should have commissary privileges because it’s convenient?
What have you (as an individual or group) done to earn the privilege?
Why would your job series allow you special benefits not allowed to the rest of the civilian work force?
Are you willing to share your benefits package with the military firefighters? ex: The military believe their TSP contributions should be matched much like the FIRS employees, are you willing to allow a portion of the civ pay budget to be dedicated to their TSP program? This may limit allowable overtime or possibly eliminate civ jobs to support.
My point is that there are sacrifices made to earn every privilege the uniformed military have. Just because it may be perceived as a “convenient” privilege, doesn’t mean that it doesn’t have value to the military members or should be included in your benefits package.
The civilian workforce is critical to the defense of our nation, but without the uniformed GI, they (we) would be unemployed. We are here to support and train the military in every aspect not share their earned benefits.
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Fireman_Jake
Lt

USA
205 Posts

Posted - Jul 30 2011 :  18:47:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
As an interesting, and slightly relevant side-note, there is a bill in congress to allow Veterans who receive disability payments to get PX and Commissary privileges. I'll post the bill number if I can find it.

Fireman Jake

My comments are my own. They do not reflect the views or opinions of my supervisors, my department nor the Air Force
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FD73
Rookie

USA
26 Posts

Posted - Jul 30 2011 :  19:43:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the discussion, I may not understand or agree with a few of your posts but none the less your feedback is appreciated...
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gochargers
Lt

235 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  09:59:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
All civilians at one AFMC base are allowed to use the class 6 and BX food courts, just not allowed to buy tobacco/alcohol items unless they have a military ID. The commissary privilege, I believe, is extended to the civilian firefighters as a courtesy for helping out the commissary management whenever they have a case lot sale and special functions. That's not confirmed but we do have an excellent working relationship with the commissary management because of the mutual agreement.
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Hog Chief
Lt

Afghanistan
117 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  11:40:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Old Timer, well said.

Proud Veteran, "Support your Deployed Firefighters"
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JoeMZ191
Rookie

USA
67 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  16:26:57  Show Profile  Send JoeMZ191 a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
We did have a local agreement to use the commissary while on duty but managers and rules change. We're fortunate to have enough Guard and retirees working to have someone authorized to shop there. It's more convenient than running off base if you get held for an overtime shift or forget something.

I disagree with Oldtimer's references. There are "authorized" users of base privileges who have done far less to be extended those benefits. It's not like they give stuff away for free. You still pay for it and the commissary still makes a profit. The price savings sure aren't what they were 20 years ago either. Even gas has been cheaper off base.

Stay safe.
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FD73
Rookie

USA
26 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  17:59:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thats what I was thinking it will probably come down to who the Manager at the Commissary and the Commander's opinion/point of view. JoeMZ191 said it well, there are many that have done far less to be extended the Commissary privilege and MUCH more. It is not like I feel that the firefighters should get to use the Commissary all of the time, I would even be happy if I could get them a punch card that they could have 3-5 uses a month. I do not think that the firefighters are entitled, as you know we work 24 hour shifts with forced overtime sometimes (some departments more than others). If I can manage an agreement I would portray to the FF's basically one abuse of the privilege and its gone.
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FireDawg24
Rookie

37 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  19:35:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Old T,
You don't "get it" because you do get it. Hog C same to you. You don't get it because you rode it too far for too long.. IMHO


"I personally have not earned the right to shop at the commissary, but I am able to do so because my wife gave 20 years to the Air Force...I don't understand this discussion, and I have been hearing the debate for more than 30 years....."
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oldtimer78
Lt

USA
102 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  20:00:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I don't mind you sharing your opinion, I just don't agree with it. Good luck to you...

quote:
Originally posted by FireDawg24

Old T,
You don't "get it" because you do get it. Hog C same to you. You don't get it because you rode it too far for too long.. IMHO


"I personally have not earned the right to shop at the commissary, but I am able to do so because my wife gave 20 years to the Air Force...I don't understand this discussion, and I have been hearing the debate for more than 30 years....."

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FireDawg24
Rookie

37 Posts

Posted - Jul 31 2011 :  20:10:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Old T,
Ditto. Be safe.....
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